[Team Roles]everything you want to know

[Team Roles]everything you want to know

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

Defining roles for sPvP in GW.

There is a ton of terminology that gets passed around about builds roles etc. but there’s not a huge amount of information on what they mean. When we talk of roles in sPvP its interchangeable with a build and can be combined with other roles or builds so not a definite this or that it’s not just a build or not a in map function. So to take this at the very basic level you build your spec / build out of the roles you want to fulfill.

Role + role + role = build

Now in to the descriptions, keep in mind some of the terminology has been carried over from other competitive pvp games and some is unique to GW2. Also I am writing this on no sleep for a day or so but needed to get this info for a website / sPvP Roster web application I am programing.

ROLES:

Name: Bunker
Characteristics: Health and toughness, survivability.
Description: A Bunker is someone who can take a ton of damage and stay alive for quite some time under pressure. They may lack some CC’s and point control but they are made to literally sit somewhere and stay there. Typically most people use a bunker as a node defender. Another note is that a team’s bunker is the beefiest of the Defenders so they are typically assigned to the midpoint

Name: Node Defender
Characteristics: Heavy CC / Point Control, Survivability (not meaning heath / toughness can be healing / evasion etc.)
Description: A node defender goes hand and hand with a bunker usually, but they will typically sacrifice some defense / health to have massive CC & point control. Node defenders typically can last quite some time but not as long as a pure bunker.

Name: Backpoint Defender
Characteristics: Survivability, utility, self-sufficient
Description: The backpoint defender is usually a build / class with survivability and utility. They typically can dps or support. Good examples of standard classes for this are Trap tank rangers and Mesmer’s running portal. Their primary goal since the points close to the base is to keep it locked down as much as possible. They can and will unlike a bunker who stays there typically till death, the backpoint defender typically has some mobility so they can flee the fight / come back after being stomped and back cap it after they assault is finished and reclaim it.

Name: Farpoint Assaulter
Characteristics: Hybrid damage & survivability, mobility.
Description: a Farpoint Assaulter is a hybrid dps, they have survivability and can do some good damage. They are the ANTI backpoint defender, their job is to assault the far point and keep it contested and uncapped. To be successful they don’t have to fully cap as long as it’s not fully capped by the other team. They typically use tactics like downing the backpoint defender and leaving him downed by doing just enough damage to maximize his time out of play. So in a nutshell they kill the backpoint defender and then harass / stall the backpoint defender from recapping as long as they can.

Name: Support
Characteristics: healing, utility, buffing, debuffing, cleansing
Description: A Support role is typically paired with a defensive build, the supportive build has high team healing, they have boon sharing, they typically have protection for reviving allies and cleanses for conditions. Supports main job is kind of like a healer in the typical MMORPG trinity except for the fact that in gw2 this does not work due to lack or healing in abundance. This role is your help your team jack of all trades buff when you can swiftness on tap etc.

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

Name: Roamer
Characteristics: sustained mobility, jack of all trades, navigation (teleport etc)
Description: The roamer has one qualification, mobility they need to be able to get across the map fast and be a first responder for help or whatever action needs to happen. Example they will be coming in for a killing blow as someone is running away towards the roamer. The build type does not matter but they are always extremely mobile. The type of player who usually plays this is someone who knows the maps, they know what the game flow is and they are thinking ahead of the game by 3 moves to anticipate where they need to be, for example being right there for that last shot to kill and steal the boss then they rush off to go support a point. Roamers are highly motivated self-thinkers who do not need to be instructed on what to do, and are also highly communicative as they are the scouts to tell everyone what’s happening on the battlefield.

Name: Team Fighter
Characteristics: Mobility, numbers based buffs / debuffs (The amount of players)
Description: A team fighter is someone who may not be Burst / glass / carry DPS or best support but they have utilities that can devastate in large groups. One major example of this is a venom share thief. Team fighters are usually assigned to a group or are constantly moving to the next battle hotspot, but are not truly a roamer they go where the fight is happening. A good team fighter can turn the tide of any battle and most high end teams will not run without one.

Name: Shutdown
Characteristics: CC, Lockdown, low cool-down cc, stun, daze etc.
Description: A shutdown is really simple. Immobilize, root, cc, lockdown, take someone out of play for 6 seconds or more. Shutdowns are used against carries/ glass cannons / stompers etc. This role is usually mixed with Team Fighter.

Name: Ranged Or Melee Carry / Glass Cannon / Burst
Characteristics: Highest DPS, Burst DPS, high cool-down skills, usually less than 4 second kills.
Description: A Cary is typically a glass cannon build, while they could be roamers these type of roles require teamwork to support them while they demolish player by player. Example a high toughness / health supporter may be assigned to guard the carry and help keep them safe while they wait for the cool downs to come back up. They can be used to ambush people as they respawn, help in team fights, assigned to the bunker as his dps for mid etc. A prime example of this is a back stab thief; yes the ones people complain about killing them in 2 seconds. But you look at them wrong and they will die. These roles sacrifice everything they can to be able to kill as fast as possible.

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

Alot of the Na teams run with 1 bunker, and 4 dps (3 power 1 cond) usually.
Condition dps are sometimes called ‘debunkers’ as they are useful for helping with quick taking down guardians.

Also, warriors will typically defensively roam because they dont have good disengage. They usually dont push the far point.
Whereas a thief, might be BOTH a defensive roamer and far point pusher.
(this isnt to say warrior never pushes far node its just alot more risky).

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

Yup exactly, the point of the roles is being able to match up your class with the roles that mix together with a build and thats what that builds for…

When i first started i was like wtf is a bunker…
so i thought this would help

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

Yup exactly, the point of the roles is being able to match up your class with the roles that mix together with a build and thats what that builds for…

When i first started i was like wtf is a bunker…
so i thought this would help

The essentials for a team seem to be a bunker, and a power dps. (usually mesme, thief, warrior). AFter that u can fool around.

some of the good paid tourny teams run.
Ele/ele, guardian, mesmer, ranger.
Ele, guardian, thief, mesmer, ranger.
Ele, ele, ele, guaridan thief (origin online sometimes does this-though eu meta is a little different).
ele,guardian, mes, mes , engy.
ele, guardian, mes , thief , warrior.

An older standard set up might have looked like.
Ele, gaurdian, mesmer, necro, thief.

Youll notice the common denominator is ele and guardian. Eles can roam super fast, are strong 1on1, decent in team fights and hold side nodes well. Guardians are pretty much the best main bunkers.
Mesmers are probably the third most popular due to timewarp and portal.

But the core youll find is a roamer who can hold a point (almost always ele) a power dps, and a guardian bunker. The rest caters to choice/match up.

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

I actually think that there’s some meta / combos we have missed… Just waiting to be the next omfg rotfolstomping

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

I actually think that there’s some meta / combos we have missed… Just waiting to be the next omfg rotfolstomping

Almost certainly. I only object to theoretical ideas ppl throw around on the forum. The official meta isnt easy to counter, thats why the top teams run something close to it. But, meta is always vunerable to clever counter play.

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

dps trip med guardian is the new meta :P

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Posted by: Zodian.6597

Zodian.6597

I actually think that there’s some meta / combos we have missed… Just waiting to be the next omfg rotfolstomping

Almost certainly. I only object to theoretical ideas ppl throw around on the forum. The official meta isnt easy to counter, thats why the top teams run something close to it. But, meta is always vunerable to clever counter play.

In competitive play it kind of works like this; run a mirror comp or run a counter comp. Most of the top NA teams have 1 or 2 comps they can use (because most people refuse to learn new classes). Team PZ for instance, likes to run 2 trap rangers (one on each side point) and 2 eles (defensive roaming between home/far/objectives), and something with decent survivability and aoe dmg such as kaypud guard or 100 nade engi (to destroy mesmer).
JBUO on the other hand, runs s/d bunker ele far push + mesmer/condi necro/bs thief, which is rely hard to deal with as double trap ranger double ele because the bunker ele counters your trap ranger on home and the thief can burst down your eles while retal guard gets dunked by condis.
Team cute runs power necro 100b war cleave comp and just lights up people in mid with lich form + time warp + 100b aoe burst, then ports back to home with Mesmer to blow up whoever went far (strong against bunker ele far push), or pressures far/objectives.

Truth is, there is no “best” comp, or even rely a set meta. There’s just like 5 strong comps/strats that everyone uses to counter one or two of the others. This is why a lot of people on NA were kitten about the skill bar lock in December.

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

Meta is plural . Its the best understood ways to play the game.
Viable in the meta means a top team could run this and win there fair share against equally skilled opposition.
Every comp has its disadvantages and trade offs. You cant cover every base.
But that isnt the same as saying its all willy nilly and doesn’t matter what you run.

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Posted by: Zodian.6597

Zodian.6597

Meta is plural . Its the best understood ways to play the game.
Viable in the meta means a top team could run this and win there fair share against equally skilled opposition.
Every comp has its disadvantages and trade offs. You cant cover every base.
But that isnt the same as saying its all willy nilly and doesn’t matter what you run.

But that’s essentially whats going on right now lol. My team can destroy frees with 5 thieves all day, went 18w/0l last Friday running 5 thieves. There just isn’t enough competition for a real meta game to form yet in spvp.
Like i said earlier, it’s pretty much just counter-comping at this point (in “higher tier” play), some teams run 5 dps and some run 1-3 bunkers. It rely doesn’t matter what you run still, because the majority of the playerbase is still nowhere near where it should be in terms of skill; this is due to lack of comprehensive design structure when it came to spvp and individual progression on the devs’ end.
Lack of a structured solo queue has rendered individual skill un-necessary, team coordination trumps everything right now. It’s rely sad in a way, but hopefully we can get the ball rolling in the next few months here.

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Posted by: ilJumperMT.4871

ilJumperMT.4871

Yup exactly, the point of the roles is being able to match up your class with the roles that mix together with a build and thats what that builds for…

When i first started i was like wtf is a bunker…
so i thought this would help

The essentials for a team seem to be a bunker, and a power dps. (usually mesme, thief, warrior). AFter that u can fool around.

some of the good paid tourny teams run.
Ele/ele, guardian, mesmer, ranger.
Ele, guardian, thief, mesmer, ranger.
Ele, ele, ele, guaridan thief (origin online sometimes does this-though eu meta is a little different).
ele,guardian, mes, mes , engy.
ele, guardian, mes , thief , warrior.

An older standard set up might have looked like.
Ele, gaurdian, mesmer, necro, thief.

Youll notice the common denominator is ele and guardian. Eles can roam super fast, are strong 1on1, decent in team fights and hold side nodes well. Guardians are pretty much the best main bunkers.
Mesmers are probably the third most popular due to timewarp and portal.

But the core youll find is a roamer who can hold a point (almost always ele) a power dps, and a guardian bunker. The rest caters to choice/match up.

Eles are a joke that needs to be nerfed. They have no counter. Amazing how bad guilds win due to abusing triple ele, despite the fact that they lose 500-0 if they run dual ele or anything else

I actually think that there’s some meta / combos we have missed… Just waiting to be the next omfg rotfolstomping

Almost certainly. I only object to theoretical ideas ppl throw around on the forum. The official meta isnt easy to counter, thats why the top teams run something close to it. But, meta is always vunerable to clever counter play.

In competitive play it kind of works like this; run a mirror comp or run a counter comp. Most of the top NA teams have 1 or 2 comps they can use (because most people refuse to learn new classes). Team PZ for instance, likes to run 2 trap rangers (one on each side point) and 2 eles (defensive roaming between home/far/objectives), and something with decent survivability and aoe dmg such as kaypud guard or 100 nade engi (to destroy mesmer).
JBUO on the other hand, runs s/d bunker ele far push + mesmer/condi necro/bs thief, which is rely hard to deal with as double trap ranger double ele because the bunker ele counters your trap ranger on home and the thief can burst down your eles while retal guard gets dunked by condis.
Team cute runs power necro 100b war cleave comp and just lights up people in mid with lich form + time warp + 100b aoe burst, then ports back to home with Mesmer to blow up whoever went far (strong against bunker ele far push), or pressures far/objectives.

Truth is, there is no “best” comp, or even rely a set meta. There’s just like 5 strong comps/strats that everyone uses to counter one or two of the others. This is why a lot of people on NA were kitten about the skill bar lock in December.

Best Comp at the moment is more eles the better! Even best teams have problems against pugs running 2-3 eles. I even met 4 eles 1 guardain team. Good thing 3 of the eles sucked and blew up.

The nerf on bunker eles cannot come fast enough. They are too tanky that can avoid everything. At least conditions/boon removal could counter guardains, but eles are immune to conditions or physical damage.

I’m going to quote lowell

“anyone who runs dual ele or more should go…….ok I better stop at that”

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Posted by: kagemitsu.3657

kagemitsu.3657

Awesome, I’ve been wanting to ask the forums for something like this and I’m glad you came up with the idea.

Thanks a lot, it’s really helpful. If a mod is reading, I’d recommend a sticky since a thread like this is useful to everyone.

(class stronger than mine) is OP. (my class) is underpowered. (classes I beat easily) are fine.

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

Awesome, I’ve been wanting to ask the forums for something like this and I’m glad you came up with the idea.

Thanks a lot, it’s really helpful. If a mod is reading, I’d recommend a sticky since a thread like this is useful to everyone.

I have a feeling that , with balance changes coming down the road the meta is in for a big shake up. that might date the info and suggestions posted here.

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

still worth a sticky =)

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Posted by: papaganoosh.7908

papaganoosh.7908

Great post mate

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Posted by: Muppet.6485

Muppet.6485

Best Comp at the moment is more eles the better! Even best teams have problems against pugs running 2-3 eles. I even met 4 eles 1 guardain team. Good thing 3 of the eles sucked and blew up.

The nerf on bunker eles cannot come fast enough. They are too tanky that can avoid everything. At least conditions/boon removal could counter guardains, but eles are immune to conditions or physical damage.

I’m going to quote lowell

“anyone who runs dual ele or more should kitten I better stop at that”

Actually immobilizing works rather well, oh, and covering it with other conditions, so they can’t just cleanse it fast. Sure we have Mist Form and depending on the other utilities sometimes one other really clean ‘Get out of jail free card’ but every class spec’d as bunker has those. I can’t say I’ve never seen an organized spike against a bunker Ele fail after you burn through their cooldowns. Which is what you do with every bunker. Burn CDs. Kill. I’m so tired about all this crying about Eles. Teams who have trouble with them just play forum warriors. Why don’t you try the comp if it’s so OP. Pretty sure that’s the definition of Meta. A build that works well against a large variety of other builds being run at that time. And adapting to the Meta is crucial in any PvP setting. So if insist you’re being griefed by these dual Ele comps, why don’t you just learn to run one yourselves. I’m not at all trying to imply you’re unskilled or that you lack experience. I just don’t see why teams who find this strategy hard to deal with don’t try playing it themselves. Find the weaknesses, and then either keep the comp or exploit it on their old one. In my opinion if running 2 Eles can frustrate teams to this extent, then obviously there’s something right about it.

tldr; If you can’t beat them, join them.

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Posted by: Durzlla.6295

Durzlla.6295

Nice post!! Idk what my engi would be…. In assuming itd be the back capper lol, the enemy natural shall be MINE!

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Posted by: dimentox.6019

dimentox.6019

Ill try to keep this updated as the meta changes or evolves.

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Posted by: Sand Beagle.9867

Sand Beagle.9867

define meta please, the word used in this context really bothers me

it makes me think of bro science, i’m not sure why

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Posted by: Muppet.6485

Muppet.6485

define meta please, the word used in this context really bothers me

it makes me think of bro science, i’m not sure why

I find the best way to put it is this:

Meta: A specific team build or composition (and there are sometimes a few of these and variations on them) that will have success against the large majority of other compositions when played with equal skill levels.

There is always a counter to a Meta, but often the first thought of builds to do this will only be able to counter a team that holds strict to that Meta and will lose to teams running anything that you’re not strictly prepared for.

Eventually someone figures out how to incorporate that countering aspect into a build that can also deal with those other versions and the Meta will change.

So you can loosely define it (and I’m not saying these are the actual Meta’s at the time, these are just purely for example) by stating roles.

Something like: one bunker, one side(off)bunker, 3 dps classes

Or you can give a stronger/specific example like: Bunker Guardian, Offbunk Trap Ranger, Condi Hybrid Nec, D/D Ele Roamer, BS Thief

This is how I think of it, feel free to correct/add

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Posted by: ahuba.6430

ahuba.6430

bump.
maybe some people starting on pvp from pve due to the monthly situation will see this and stop capping close point with 3 guys.

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Posted by: Rump Buffalo.2594

Rump Buffalo.2594

I actually think that there’s some meta / combos we have missed… Just waiting to be the next omfg rotfolstomping

theyll never be found due to the game’s competitiveness slowly disintigrating

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Posted by: daydream.2938

daydream.2938

Most teams run home node defender, usually Mesmer or ranger. A power dps, a condition dps, a bunker, then X and ele.

Eles are nearly universal, you will often see to, and other than the main bunker you can essentially replace anything with an ele.

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Posted by: Archaon.6245

Archaon.6245

Defining roles for sPvP in GW.

There is a ton of terminology that gets passed around about builds roles etc. but there’s not a huge amount of information on what they mean. When we talk of roles in sPvP its interchangeable with a build and can be combined with other roles or builds so not a definite this or that it’s not just a build or not a in map function. So to take this at the very basic level you build your spec / build out of the roles you want to fulfill.

Bunker…Ele…yes you can leave it at mid if you have fast backup…other eles off course

Node Defender…Ele

Backpoint Defender…Ele

Farpoint Assaulter…Ele what else….

Support…the same ele…starting to get boring btw…

Roamer…still ele

Team Fighter…when is not contesting…ele

Burst…guess what? Yep…you’re right…

Morale? If you have to play something…play ele…

Thanks once again anet..

(edited by Archaon.6245)

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Posted by: Oni Link.4621

Oni Link.4621

Well written topic ^^ A nice introduction to SPVP for new players, well done

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Posted by: Hjulstad.6317

Hjulstad.6317

Very nice write up

Member of TUP
@
Aurora Glade

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Posted by: Empathetic Fighter.2065

Empathetic Fighter.2065

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

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Posted by: Archaon.6245

Archaon.6245

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

Rtl nerf almost solved that..at least you don’t get 2-3 ele teams anymore, 2 engi or 2 rangers are more common now but they’re not as stupid as 2+ eles were 1 months ago imo..

Right now i think we could say…“Play everything you like..but don’t play warrior”

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Posted by: Empathetic Fighter.2065

Empathetic Fighter.2065

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

Rtl nerf almost solved that..at least you don’t get 2-3 ele teams anymore, 2 engi or 2 rangers are more common now but they’re not as stupid as 2+ eles were 1 months ago imo..

Right now i think we could say…“Play everything you like..but don’t play warrior”

Mabye the new meta will be 5 kill-shot warriors with banners. Spiking a target was never easier.

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Posted by: Lupanic.6502

Lupanic.6502

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

Rtl nerf almost solved that..at least you don’t get 2-3 ele teams anymore, 2 engi or 2 rangers are more common now but they’re not as stupid as 2+ eles were 1 months ago imo..

Right now i think we could say…“Play everything you like..but don’t play warrior”

I saw 2 ranger team once playing against TP but who is playing with 2 engi?

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Posted by: Archaon.6245

Archaon.6245

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

Rtl nerf almost solved that..at least you don’t get 2-3 ele teams anymore, 2 engi or 2 rangers are more common now but they’re not as stupid as 2+ eles were 1 months ago imo..

Right now i think we could say…“Play everything you like..but don’t play warrior”

I saw 2 ranger team once playing against TP but who is playing with 2 engi?

Depends on the map…at foefire there are many playing with 2 hgh bombing mid and i’ve to say they’re quite a pain if you’re the bunker guardian under them..kittenton of aoe conditions everywhere..

(edited by Archaon.6245)

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Posted by: Archaon.6245

Archaon.6245

GJ on summarizing
To ele: This class has an unlimited choice in what role he likes to play (bunker, roamer, teamsupport). But the meta evolved and BM-Rangers, Kit-Engis and S/D thiefs bring hard counter to them. In EU for example you saw every dual-ele comp dissapearing but two or three teams.

Rtl nerf almost solved that..at least you don’t get 2-3 ele teams anymore, 2 engi or 2 rangers are more common now but they’re not as stupid as 2+ eles were 1 months ago imo..

Right now i think we could say…“Play everything you like..but don’t play warrior”

Mabye the new meta will be 5 kill-shot warriors with banners. Spiking a target was never easier.

Don’t forget those unstoppable 5 sig wars too…